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Cassandrich

The level to which systemd stans demand you prove claims against systemd that you didn't even make as soon as they see you say something they interpret as vaguely "anti-systemd" is really astounding and impressive.

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Irenes (many)

@dalias right, like, the really frustrating thing is that we like almost all of systemd's architectural decisions... and we do believe there need to be more people paying attention to overall ecosystem health stuff with Linux... but we don't like the clear hegemonic intent. BDFL is not an appropriate governance structure for something with this scope.

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Cassandrich

@irenes At least 75% of my objection to systemd is governance & unilateral imposition of policy.

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R. L. Dane :debian: :openbsd:

@dalias @irenes

Really feels like the bazaar is turning into a handful of cathedrals.
Gnome, systemd, and a couple of powerful distros laying down the law.

Its creepy. And I actually *like* a couple (but not all) systemd modules.

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[object Object]

@RL_Dane @dalias @irenes this is at the root of my distaste for systemd and the gnome ecosystem too, and it cuts deeper than any technical issues I have with systemd (though extreme resistance to technical improvements from outsiders does go hand in hand with cathedral-style development)

[object Object]

@RL_Dane @dalias @irenes also, it’s weird and fucking ridiculous that I have to maintain a large multi-service blocklist of systemd stans and red hat employees just to avoid being signal jammed with toxic nonsense every time I want to discuss anything negative about their ecosystem. this particular cathedral has already used its position to destroy our ability to effectively communicate, and I do resent that

Mar 06, 2024, 01:20 AM·Public·Mona for iPhone
3boosts·4favorites
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Irenes (many)

@zzt @RL_Dane @dalias yes, please notice how carefully and precisely we speak on this topic, with minimal side remarks that could be willfully misunderstood... we shouldn't have to, but, well, if that's the game, at least we know how to win it.

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